mad world

merry christmas amigos,

I know I haven't made much fanfare of this holiday season. I forgot to put up the Holiday YTMNDs section, I didn't even add any sparkly decorations to the front page. I know I always talk about how busy I am, but I've been spending a good deal of time reflecting on YTMND's history and future. I was thinking about doing up some big "ghosts of YTMND past, present, and future" deal but instead I'll just get right to the meat of it, plus I'm hungry.


The last month has been bizarre to say the least. I had dinner with moot the other night. Turns out we face a lot of similar issues. Neither of us makes any money and have hundreds of thousands of people who take us for granted. This made me feel a bit better about YTMND's situation, but it also really got me thinking about what YTMND will be in five years, or even five months for that matter.

It's been a almost eight months since I've updated the TODO list. In that time I've spent hundreds if not thousands of hours discussing various pieces of YTMND with just about anyone willing to discuss it. One of the major themes, and the bits I get the most criticism for is the moderation system (or lack thereof).

One thing I've slowly realized over the last few months is that when I started, I really had no clear idea of what the goals of a good moderation system really were. I had designed a grandiose system with hundreds of complex doodads and widgets, but for what? I'm trying hard not to mention Shirky's article, but I keep going back to it.

The main focus of the moderation system was to make sure sites were always moderated and classified properly, but that doesn't really matter at all. I have poured a huge amount of my time and resources that have been poured into a system that does all of the wrong things really well. One thing I've learned from a decade of making dumb websites is that you need to know when it is easier to scrap something and start from scratch than it is to change it to do what you want.

So that being said, I have updated the TODO (and even made a parser that makes a "pretty version") in a massive way. Over 1000 lines added, 55,000 characters of every idea I have had, heard or thought was worth remembering in the last year, as well as a large amount of information I'm publishing in hopes that we can start a dialogue on how the site should be.

This is your christmas gift from me. You have the chance to decide how YTMND will turn out. The time for criticism, bickering and general mockery is over friends. If you have any fondness left for YTMND, now is the time to speak up and help to decide where to go from here. I can't (and won't) do it alone.

So over the next week, check out the TODO, and spend some time thinking about the pieces that are most important or relevant to you. Comment on things you want or don't like. Be constructive. Be a productive member of society, because as soon as I sober up from new years, I'm going to be seriously shaking shit up.


So a good deal of the starbar bugs are fixed, but it hasn't been implemented everywhere yet. If there are any remaining show-stoppers let me know. Also I did another thing I never thought I'd do and made a quick Facebook widget which does dumb stuff like tell your friends when you make or favorite a YTMND and adds pretty junk to your otherwise bland profile. Check it out if you actually have any friends to share with.



Have a good holiday and a happy new year. Don't drink and drive.

-Max

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<< 1 2 >>
December 26th, 2007
194th
(0)
so its gonna be more like MYtnd.com huh?
December 26th, 2007
195th
(0)
LOL,Mytmnd.com
December 26th, 2007
197th
(-2)
anal
December 26th, 2007
200th
(3)
'"Downations" - the ability to counter sponsor a site' I still don't know why you are considering this one. You'll probably have to add a seperate 'I agree' check box prior to donation just to avoid being sued over $20. But mainly I just think it would cause a lot of people not to donate. Why give people a reason not to donate? Not really good business - even if it is a pretty cool idea. Maybe just move that out of the top left slot instead. That slot should go to Top Rated This Week anyway, shouldn't it?
December 28th, 2007
303rd
(3)
totally agree with Umfulf
December 26th, 2007
201st
(0)
YTMND store to help fund the site. Also, gj max. The site has improved a lot.
December 26th, 2007
202nd
(0)
Merry Christmas Max.
December 26th, 2007
203rd
(0)
...smoke & fly!
December 26th, 2007
204th
(0)
anyway - i still say make ALL ytmnds nsfw then the mods can handpick ones to be classed ws - maybe the ws/nsfw button can flag up potential ws sites quicker to give them a chance of getting on the main page sooner (idk just thinking out loud except quietly on a keyboard)
December 26th, 2007
207th
(0)
one feature i would like is to have the option to ignore all fearcondoms sites. can this be done . PM me . i love you
December 26th, 2007
211th
(0)
'domain upgrades' - Does this matter? Does anyone really look for good ytmnds by typing in blind urls? Is this something that guy who plays fanfare is trying to get you to do?
December 28th, 2007
307th
(0)
^
December 29th, 2007
328th
(0)
no, i just see a lot of really good domains go to waste. one of the big hesitations is that it would most likely be abused more often than it will be used properly.
December 26th, 2007
212th
(0)
Interesting ideas under 'USER SIGNUP'. I like the idea behind the last entry there. Though I don't like anything with 'rating' and 'delete' in the same sentence. People who abuse alts are the same people who will upvote their own new alt profiles to make sure they stick. Some dumb 13 year old trying to YTMND for the first time shouldn't be punished just because fourest is so bad at YTMNDing that he has to cheat
December 26th, 2007
214th
(-1)
Hide most viewed daily between midnight and 2am <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3
December 26th, 2007
215th
(-1)
Add a "PRIVATE" option. Won't show up in searches, keywords, front page, random etc <3 <3 <3
December 26th, 2007
217th
(-1)
'The ability to create a new site and hide your identity for ~3 hours after the site is made.' This was one of the first things I thought of when I first signed up here. But here's the catch - Seems to me the only way people who abuse alt accounts can be dealt with right now is if they are exposed and the community acts to downvote them and make it not worth it. Sadly, most of the YTMND community fails to understand the importance of this and most abusers have little reason to stop even after being caught.
December 26th, 2007
218th
(-1)
So even though this seems completely logical and should be a good way to get fair voting I think it opens the door for cheaters while closing the only door people have to stop abuse. But I know I would certainly benifit from it, so what the f*ck. Might as well do it if you can.
December 26th, 2007
219th
(0)
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(0)
Max you're fraternizing with the enemy!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Down with 4khan!
December 26th, 2007
220th
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(0)
And in closing, heh, this may be the worst suggestion ever and I may have made it before but: maybe the spy and having what you voted next to your comments is bad. Perhaps very very very bad. The only people who can get a hit site lately are people who only vote 5. It's horrible, dude. And as long as everyone knows what you are voting that will continue. How many people have accounts they use just for voting so people don't know? I don't because I'm not a pussy, but I bet millions upon millions of people do
December 26th, 2007
224th
(-3)
Gary Jules or Tears for Fears?
December 26th, 2007
225th
(0)
Max Goldberg in:"My dinner with moot"
December 26th, 2007
226th
(0)
I read the part about the reason for NSFW and advertisers. Maybe there is a way to set up two flags, "NSFW" for sites that contain obscenities, nudity or offensive material and a hidden "NSFW advertiser flag" that will still let those sites show up, but not be associated with advertisers.
December 26th, 2007
227th
(1)
I LOVE the idea of an award system.
December 26th, 2007
234th
(4)
right, because now that ratings are all but meaningless we can give meaningless awards based on those meaningless ratings
December 27th, 2007
283rd
(1)
If you hate it so much- leave... and take your ball with you.
December 27th, 2007
284th
(0)
when did i say I hate it? I just wish there were more people like you - who seem to at least try to vote fairly
December 26th, 2007
240th
(1)
(-.\)
December 26th, 2007
241st
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Chocolate Microscopes. Also, reward system sounds awesome. Ranks would be pretty cool, and the rank could go up for making good sites and go down for making bad sites or dumb comments, i.e. call max a kike.
December 26th, 2007
242nd
(0)
Reading the TODO list the most important things I read were the sound player since QuickTime killed WAV looping and broke MP3's a little bit more than usual a few updates ago. That and the moderation system of course however as you have stated you basically spent a sh*t load of time on something that doesn't accomplish too much in the long run. What I feel YTMND needs more than moderation maintained by people is to moderate itself. Perhaps limit the amount of sites a user can make per X amount of time.
December 26th, 2007
243rd
(1)
To me that would not only help reduce sites that could be considered personal or inside jokes but it would also help users who try to bring valuable, entertaining and comedic content to YTMND think their idea out a little bit more and make them take into consideration "if I post this site now I can't post another one until the defined time passes." And as I thought that out I thought of certain users that shouldn't apply to and others it should...so I'm conflicted on my own input.
December 30th, 2007
351st
(0)
I like this idea. It will help reduce spamming troll sites by Mariostar06 and DougFukkie and their ilk.
December 26th, 2007
244th
(0)
No to the censorship, it's for pussies. Also, Lando for mod.
December 26th, 2007
247th
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Just remember Max a site starts dying as soon as you run out of ideas to put in it. At this rate you can expect YTMND.com to template of how community ran sites should be in the future. Keep up the good work.
December 26th, 2007
248th
(2)
Would it be possible to automatically retire sites from appearing on Top Viewed after they're more than a week old? I figured that it would make sense since Sponsored and Top Rated work on a weekly basis as well. Besides, I've seen like five sites from over a year ago show up there in the past two weeks.
December 26th, 2007
253rd
(1)
this is a great idea
December 26th, 2007
255th
(2)
What about making it so they don't appear on the front page if they are more than a week old, but appear on the main list? Is that possible?
December 26th, 2007
257th
(1)
That's the idea.
December 28th, 2007
304th
(1)
I think it's kind of neat when Top Viewed suddenly gets smacked with some site you wouldn't expect.
December 26th, 2007
249th
(1)
"New Feature Find the user who made the YTMND corner image thing for his dorm door and get permission to sell them" Hello dere. doortmnd.ytmnd.com You have permission; although do you really need it, it being your image and all?
December 26th, 2007
250th
(0)
Also, feel free to sell giant posters of Foot Doctor, and Foot Doctor action figures, and costumes, and severed feet with mirrors attached.
December 27th, 2007
275th
(0)
ball-in
December 26th, 2007
251st
(0)
Hey now! http://www.cracked.com/article_15163_5-most-unintentionally-hilarious-movie-sex-acts.html
December 28th, 2007
302nd
(0)
HEY NOW!
December 26th, 2007
254th
(0)
there needs to be a forum that isnt filled with power-hungry fascist c*nts who wont take anyone with under 5 000 posts seriously
December 26th, 2007
271st
(1)
"moot" is a letter away from "foot".... does that blow your mind, or what?
January 9th, 2008
423rd
(0)
DOCTOR
December 27th, 2007
273rd
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the [ FILE SYSTEM / ASSET MANAGEMENT ] section is interesting... the site-size thing sounds really cool. I'm not so sure about some of the other stuff, though. I am certainly against child pornography, so I guess I don't really have a reason to be against the MPAA or RIAA, but I"m still iffy about the searching records thing (especially since all the "Pizza Baby" things from last night would result in searches and arrests).
December 27th, 2007
277th
(0)
The "Original Creator" thing is nice, but would people use it inappropriately? I mean, we all know there are people who will make a site and for image and sound origins write "you suck" and "big balls," so what's saying they won't do that and say it's their own pic/music? Plus, you can give yourself credit for either, as some people do.
December 27th, 2007
274th
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[ comment is below rating threshold and has been hidden ]
(-7)
Hey Max...quit being a neurotic f*cking emokike. That would help. Quit your heeby bitching or just shut the f*cking site down.
December 27th, 2007
276th
(-2)
[ comment is below rating threshold and has been hidden ]
(-2)
max: replace the header "ytmnds by featured users" with "arbeit mach frei"
December 27th, 2007
279th
(-1)
I would really like to see the Hall of Fame updated.
December 27th, 2007
282nd
(-4)
[ comment is below rating threshold and has been hidden ]
(-4)
This just in: no one gives a sh*t.
December 27th, 2007
287th
(0)
I wish I could help you Max, I do have Dreamweaver CS3 but when it comes to making anything of actual worth I fail. Happy Christmas. Thanks for such a great site!
December 27th, 2007
288th
(0)
kwanza...rofl
December 27th, 2007
289th
(0)
Grey Goose Holiday Hangovers FTW!
December 27th, 2007
292nd
(2)
hello this is Boris from Russia and we my family love ice cream we buy the Bryer vanilia every 3rd tuesday of every 4 month when it come to market. on some special time my wife she freeze yogurt made from our goat and we have ice cream made at my home yes. My daughter natalia wants flovor of straws berrys and my son he wants the exsotic chocolatee and my wife she want a mule.
December 27th, 2007
295th
(3)
You should focus on the Monetization first. As I'm sure you're aware, money has an amazing effect on one's enthusiasm for improving an existing project.
December 27th, 2007
296th
(1)
One thing I agree with in the todo list is all the porn issues. WAY to much 'lawl luk at my pr0n' out there. Nudity is ok if it's comical or is part of the joke but just strait porn needs to be deleted. This isn't a porn site.
December 27th, 2007
297th
(0)
"This isn't a porn site." yeah, and that's another one of the problems we have to fix... we really need to change our priorities
December 27th, 2007
300th
(0)
i think the friends and enemies thing would be solid gold
December 28th, 2007
311th
(0)
I have a question. Did anyone accually read all the comments? if so where did you get the time?
January 8th, 2008
422nd
(0)
I took the day off
December 28th, 2007
312th
(0)
Fix your bugs, be less vague.. Wtf do you mean "tell me the direction" THat makes no sense. And fix your bugs. Get some competent mods.. You know, ones that know how to follow your very simple posting rules.. And fix the f*cking bugs. Oh hey fix the voting bug you said you fixed. You didn't fix it. Mods. Bugs. Mods. Bugs. Is it getting through to you yet?
December 29th, 2007
315th
(0)
Went through some of the TODO. Comments/suggestions:
December 29th, 2007
316th
(1)
The search features on the TODO look promising. It's very very difficult to find some of the older sites unless you know the name of the site, which often doesn't have to do with the content itself. The improved keyword features and being able to add keywords to older legacy sites is a good idea.
December 29th, 2007
317th
(0)
Remove featured users entirely. Anyone who has been here for any significant period of time who know is worthy of "featured" anyways, and pays attention to their sites as such.
December 29th, 2007
318th
(1)
Moderation: Anyone abusing the voting system (alts/chaindownvoting/etc) should have their all votes removed and voting on their account locked. They can still view sites and make sites, just can't vote. People abusing alts should have their alts deleted and main account locked. People abusing comments should have their ability to comment locked and all comments they have made removed. People abusing site creation would have that locked. Penalties can be permanent or for a certain length of time.
December 29th, 2007
319th
(0)
I think a good idea would be an option to set a field in a site to list another site as an "inspiration." As most sites and based around something else, being able to track upwards through them for the chain of humor without depending on the image/audio source being filled in linking the other site would be nice. The lists seem like another way of allowing each person to do this manually for their own use. The lists look good too.
December 29th, 2007
320th
(0)
An archive feature, or preventing significant changes to the image/audio...something to prevent people from changing their high rated sites to "trap" sites either by someone hacking their account or malicious intentions.
December 29th, 2007
321st
(1)
I like the "anonymous site authoring" idea. I think the time period should be longer, 24 hours perhaps, as that's enough to go through the top viewed for the day, which should be enough for all to see it before the revenge voters hit it.
December 29th, 2007
322nd
(1)
The "idolize/friend/enemy/troll" system seems promising.
December 29th, 2007
323rd
(0)
The site is fine, it's the people that are destroying it. You need lots of moderation. It's just a matter of finding dependable ones. I don't think he should use current ytmnd users as mods. A small troop should suffice, if there were 48 of them each would only have to dedicate a half hour a day to monitor incoming sites...
December 29th, 2007
324th
(0)
All they have to do is follow the guidelines for what is and is not allowed. This way we get less drunk friends sites, less 4chan trash, and everything is NSFW'd properly. I feel this is the first step in getting undesireables off the site.. With certain TYPES of people gone, we will have an evironment more condusive to creativity and an exchange of opinions.
December 29th, 2007
325th
(1)
You can easily see what a hostile environment it is.. Partially because it attracts children, but also due to its' basic lawlessness. You can't have a peaceful anarchy any more than you can have an ad-free site, and dear Max I'm afraid the monkeys are running the zoo.
December 29th, 2007
330th
(0)
Hey Max, I've been floating around YTMND for awhile now and never commented. Anyhow, I have a few opinons regarding YTMND. From a simplified standpoint, I think the site already has a lot going for it. Obviously, millions of people view it. Thus that need is fulfilled. It sounds to me like now is the time to seek investors or perhaps an "Angel" to float startup cash. Once startup money is secured along with a board of directors, cash will be available to seek monetization.
December 29th, 2007
331st
(0)
Secondly, with startup potential, perhaps the money needed to manage "legal affairs" aka-problems with site material that could otherwise cause problems. Secondly, what initially drew me to the site was the random craziness that seemed present in the material. I have to admit that over the last year, the content of the submitted pieces have become a bit more... tame. tame is safe, but tame also means that what drew many to the site-good or bad- is missing.
December 29th, 2007
332nd
(0)
Lastly, as I mentioned before, you already have several of the most vital ingredients necessary for commercial success: Brand, concept, content, and an audience. The only lacking thing is monetization. So in my opinion, now is time to hit the street and do some searching for investors. I've been in Silicon Valley for years and been part of a number of startups. You have the idea and the concept. Forget the whole monitoring system and focus on the business aspect of the company first.
December 29th, 2007
337th
(0)
Is it just me or are blue stars gone again? lol
December 29th, 2007
338th
(0)
preparing for major updates, had to turn them off temporarily
December 30th, 2007
339th
(0)
whoa, new featured people!
December 30th, 2007
341st
(1)
with black names!
December 30th, 2007
342nd
(0)
can you take me off HOF too please? (I won't delete my acct)
December 30th, 2007
348th
(0)
For some reason the new featured user's names will show up as pink in the Quick Search Results but not on the front page, lol
December 31st, 2007
370th
(0)
Any featured user list are worthless as long as Gr33nscr33n, awesomebob, lowcast, and click are not on it.
January 4th, 2008
392nd
(0)
People will complain no matter what. At least you don't make the same sites and use the same ideas over and over again.
December 30th, 2007
344th
(0)
Montly Face-offs, yearly face offs, ect. for funniest, best produced, best sound...ect. I bet that would spark interest again...also the "one line commenters" are still a big problem for me.
December 30th, 2007
345th
(0)
whats with the black names? new featured users?
December 30th, 2007
346th
(0)
Maybe the "black" FUs (it's funy becuse its an aberviation of curse wordz that make us lok odler like camel cigars lol!!!) aren't really featured. Or are they? Or is it involving the tattoo thing? Or is it some sort of undercover set of Featured Users made to look like they aren't even though they show up on the front page so they really aren't undercover? ....I think I broke my brain.
December 30th, 2007
347th
(-4)
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(-4)
i quit
December 30th, 2007
359th
(1)
Max, I wrote a list of ideas, but most of them have already been discussed in this news section. Especially the part about dealing with alts. I really like the idea of taking away voting and comment abilities from problematic people. I don't want to be redundant so I'll add this about the Hall of Fame. Set thresholds to be eligible. Like a site has to have over 500,000 views, over 4.25 rating, 2000 votes and 200 favorites.
December 30th, 2007
360th
(1)
December 31st, 2007
361st
(0)
Hey max, if you're redesigning the front page I think a good course of action would be to give users a customizable layout color option, so that we can choose whatever layout color we like. If people spend time around their favorite color, then they'll most likely want to spend more time on this site. It's subtle and crazy, but it should be pretty effective. Also, in the old days sites in the Top Viewed would almost always get around 20k views and 700 votes. Now Top Viewed sites are lucky to get even a
December 31st, 2007
362nd
(0)
quarter of that amount. I realize this is largely due to a decrease in visitors, but it might also be because of the location of Top Viewed on the page. Right now it is scrunched down in the corner and people would likely see it last. Before in the old layout it dominated the main page. It was difficult to even browse the main page without even accidentally clicking a site in Top Viewed. Here's an example: http://web.archive.org/web/20060423074540/http://www.ytmnd.com/
December 31st, 2007
363rd
(0)
Of course, these ideas are aimed mostly towards people just passing by the site, not as much people who are already addicted. Yet, if we draw in more people, then the addicts that make good sites will have much more of a motivation, and then more people would come because of that, and hopefully it would cause some circular effect (in a perfect world, but let's remain optimistic). Things were pretty much like that in the old layout.
December 31st, 2007
364th
(0)
I think a good way to get it back to the old layout would be to switch Featured Users with Top Viewed, and put Top Rated above Recently Created. Top Rated and Top Viewed are supposed to have the currently best sites, but they're at the bottom of the page. Instead the first thing visitors see is Recently Created and Featured Users, both of which almost always have bad sites. (I know about Customized Layouts, but people visiting the site definitely will not)
December 31st, 2007
365th
(0)
By the way, I love the idea of a T-Shirt design contest. That should spark some creativity among good users, hopefully. ...Well, most will certainly be fad compilations, but I'm sure there will be alternate creative design ideas for the shirt...
January 3rd, 2008
389th
(-3)
lol
December 31st, 2007
366th
(0)
filibuster for featured.
December 31st, 2007
367th
(0)
I'm always a bit surprised that icons next to users names aren't used. Something similar to BBReports, little 8x8 or 16x16 icons to denote what they're a part of. YTMND could have stuff like active account for over x years, donater, average score over y stars, moderator, "featured" user, YTMND tattoo'd user, etc.
December 31st, 2007
368th
(0)
Basically, things that are for the long run. With the mod system, you have results that are almost instantaneous, aka, wow look the highest voted site for today. But acknowledging some of the accomplishments like the above would be more of a long-term deal.
December 31st, 2007
371st
(0)
I LOVE YOU YTMND AND MAX, DON'T LEAVE ME!
December 31st, 2007
372nd
(-2)
testing, 1 2 3, testing
January 1st, 2008
373rd
(0)
Happy ballin' new year
January 1st, 2008
374th
(-3)
I got the last comment of 2007 in YTMNEWS and I got the first nested comment of 2008 in YTMNEWS
January 1st, 2008
378th
(6)
You know how users' profiles display 5 sites that are the most recent and 5 that are highest ranked. what if there was an additional 5 sites that we get to choose? sites we want people to see that are older and lower ranked.
January 1st, 2008
379th
(0)
good call dude
January 2nd, 2008
380th
(0)
I'd like to see the return of the Worthwhile YTMNDs section on the front page. Oh, and does anyone remember the Last 5 Searches box? http://dougsex.ytmnd.com/
January 2nd, 2008
381st
(0)
I remember now, that was a good feature.
January 4th, 2008
391st
(1)
Yeah, get the search thingy back. Loved it. Also, there's like a billion site, but most of them never gets viewed. They are in the "recently created" box for some time, and after that, they just disappear(I don't think anyone ever uses the "random ytmnd's" box). A shame. There must be loads of worthwhile sites buried in the murky depths of this site...
January 5th, 2008
395th
(1)
Last 18 Searches: http://www.ytmnd.com/search
January 6th, 2008
409th
(1)
What other ytmnd.com/whatevers are there? Why aren't these made public?
January 6th, 2008
410th
(1)
here they are http://wiki.ytmnd.com/YTMND_Easter_Eggs
January 2nd, 2008
382nd
(0)
jesus christ thats a large to do list
January 4th, 2008
390th
(6)
Would you open up a f*cking shop already so we can buy sh*t? i've been waiting forever. Oh, and YTMND is going downhill for the same reason 4chan is. More new people, old funny guys leaving. Lack of original content, new fads not as funny.
January 6th, 2008
400th
(0)
+- "Hardcore mode" option. +-- When you sign up, you must make one site, if it gets a rating under 2.5 +-- for a period of 24 hours, your account gets deleted. That would be f*cking awesome haha. Also you could use the section of sites rated 4 or higher (And maybe do it by number of views to because alot of big ytmnds are low rated but highly viewed) to redo the hall of fame. Have an option to vote the site into the hall of fame. Also making the turning on or off NSFW sites thing a little more
January 6th, 2008
411th
(0)
Yeah the idea of voting sites into Hall of Fame is a great idea
January 6th, 2008
412th
(0)
I mean, as long as there's also an option to vote it out of Hall of Fame, in order to override large circle groups voting all their sites into it.
January 6th, 2008
413th
(0)
Instead of a default "recently created" section, I'd like that replaced with a "least voted" section or something. Too many YTMNDs end up never getting looked at.
January 6th, 2008
414th
(0)
There used to be one, and it sucked.
January 6th, 2008
415th
(0)
http://ytmnd.com/browse/least_votes
January 6th, 2008
416th
(1)
It would be good if it replaced recently created completely.
January 6th, 2008
418th
(0)
I think least voted on is more effective than recently created at making sure sites get exposure before disappearing.
January 7th, 2008
419th
(0)
gabbly works again
January 8th, 2008
420th
(0)
I got a Wii.
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